Is getting legs…
Last week, Senator Elissa Slotkin (D-MI) and other Democrats shared a video directed at members of the military and intelligence communities. In that video, they said our armed forces have an obligation to disobey “illegal orders” given by President Trump and his administration.
President Trump called them out for it, and rightly noted the penalties for sedition and treason can include a death sentence. The Democrats, who just essentially called for a military coup against a duly elected President, responded to that factual statement by Trump as “proof” that he was calling for political violence against them.
Now, Slotkin went on ABC and admitted the President has not issued any illegal orders.
Full article, HERE from Townhall.
For something that the Dems ‘thought’ would be a throwaway and good for fundraising, it’s taking a turn they didn’t expect. The backlash from the administration and the military, along with the escalation of the questions are now to the point they are all being asked pointedly about actual illegal orders, and what they actually meant by their little video.
It also appears Mark Kelly, since he’s actually a retired officer, can potentially be recalled to active duty to face military punishment under the UCMJ. It’s going to be interesting to see where this one goes!
So far, not a single one of these idjits has come up with any illegal orders, and are obfuscating and crawfishing as hard as they can about ‘legalities’, yada, yada, yada.
Now here is Article 92 of the UCMJ- Failure to obey order or regulation
Any person subject to this chapter who-
(1) violates or fails to obey any lawful general order or regulation;
(2) having knowledge of any other lawful order issued by a member of the armed forces, which it is his duty to obey, fails to obey the order; or
(3) is derelict in the performance of his duties;
shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.
Military personnel must not carry out blatantly unlawful actions, but the legal standard is narrow.
Unlawful orders are not simply orders someone dislikes or finds questionable. They involve clear violations of U.S. or international law, such as intentionally targeting civilians or committing acts explicitly prohibited by statute. It is not up to the individual military member to determine legality or illegality. That is the purview of the the Judge Advocate General (JAG) officers, usually in hindsight or years later depending on the politics of the situation… sigh…
This really gets to the core of who controls the military, which isn’t really a question. The fact is the military answers through the CJCS to the President, NOT to congresscritters. They should have, IMHO, kept their mouths shut and stop trying to foment problems within the military…
Grrrr…
Yep. I don’t have a way to describe these individuals that I can use in polite company (but my inner Gunny really wants to be let out…)
And we all know that, sooner or later, some young seabag lawyer E-4 or some politically correct O-4 is going to try it. And the only thing these individuals do is cry crocodile tears as they try to hide their filthy smiles.
Those are the same senators who withheld military pay for 45 days, froze out SNAP benefits and caused other, widespread pain to the individual members of the military. Now they are goading those same, military individuals to risk military law.
Yeah, they are “not your friend”.
Obama replaced 163 Generals & Admirals in the DOD with Woke officers and they are still there. They then proceeded to replace subordinates with those who “thought the same way they did”. This video might well have been an attempt to provide cover for these members, “who didn’t obey an order because I thought it was illegal” and would therefore disobey President Trump orders.
Miley was an early example of this and is still not in Leavenworth.
Will they be prosecuted? They should be, but I doubt they will. At the least, they should be impeached, but that requires more courage, and integrity, than is found in anyone in Congress.
Kelley needs to be court martialed, and if found guilty, given the most severe punishment allowed.
Each chamber can discipline its members via censure, expulsion, etc. Impeachment of legislature members is questionable.
Yeah, one of that crew, (I don’r know who, I was half listening not watching) on an interview program, stated that the members of the military should ask a JAG Officer if an order was lawful. Like that’ll work out well for the E4 every time a superior gives him an order he goes running to JAG to see if it’s a lawful order.
Apparently they want to adopt the Communist ideal of having a political officer approve any decision a line officer or NCO makes.
Hey Old NFO,
All these clowns did was disrupt the good order and discipline of the U.S. Military and screw over the careers of lower enlisted Snuffy that will try to barracks lawyer their way out of UCMJ action when they use the excuse “my congresscritter said it was ok…” and they will run on the wall of reality, all because those morons wanted to try to score fundraising points. THey need to make examples out of some of these people, but with Comer getting his case dismissed on a technicality , I am wondering of the DOJ and the JAG office has the balls to do whats right, or follow the political winds.
The only Unlawful orders I have heard of are coming from democrat Mayors and Governors ordering Police to stand down and not assist ICE in their lawful duties.
Speaking of illegal orders, I hear that you and a few Texas compatriots are escalating a campaign of combat with the denizens of Oklahoma (cough… LL …cough).
Seems that you’re making things worse by lighting the fuses of the dynamite that’s being thrown across the river. Soon, they’ll start throwing grenades, and I assume that you’ll be raising the bar by pulling the pin on the grenades and throwing them back.
From there, they’ll throw bullets at you, you’ll put them in a rifle and fire them back?
For shame…
“Now, Slotkin went on ABC and admitted the President has not issued any illegal orders.”
Follow up question that should have been pressed hard: “Please cite an example of an illegal order”. Of course, they can’t. All of which cuts to the heart of the problem. They. Don’t. Care. These people have no shame. Certainly make them look like the fools and traitors they are, but don’t expect that alone to change anything.
All- Agreed! But it gets ‘interesting’ if somebody does refuse an order and then says it’s because of the video. THEN you get into sedition by those six… And THAT will truly set the cat among the pigeons.
This was signalling to their voting base, not the military.
This was a move politically against Trump.
I’m afraid, regardless of motive, they carefully only recited current USMJ policy.
However: Epoch Times FBI Seeking to Interview Lawmakers in ‘Illegal Orders’ Video
https://www.theepochtimes.com/us/fbi-seeking-to-interview-lawmakers-in-illegal-orders-video-5949712
Once again nothing but Sturm Un Drang….a lot of noise and smoke but NOTHING of consequence. NOBODY will be arrested, charged or even inconvenienced for their willfully criminal conduct.
Akin to making inflammatory statements and then claiming “I’m just asking questions!” (Looking at you, Qatarlson…)
Is Trump’s use of military assets to fight transnational narco cartels causing them to pressure the Congress critter’s fund raisers? Nah, that would never happen.
Ed- Probably…but it got out of hand.
Dan- Agreed…dammit
Drang- Yeah, right.
WSF- Possible…
In basic training in UCMJ class we were taught that if we were unsure if an order is legal to comply and then take it up the chain of command.
Yeah, perhaps a lot of cartel cash behind various congressmen.
The one I have paid close attention to, and find suspect because of votes, is a Republican.
If the higher estimates of fifty million criminal aliens in the US during the previous regime are correct, it might be unlikely for the cartels to have a small and insignificant influence on US politics.
(Recall that criminal organizations came among, and flourished within, every group of immigrants. I don’t know of any among the Pilgrams, for ex, but where New England is concerned that is probably just my ignorance about a very niche area of history. England only started transporting criminals to Australia /after/ they lost access to the North american colonies that they had been transporting to.)
Anyway, accusing Trump, falsely, of giving illegal orders, is maybe not at all a new matter. Depending on how one interprets one of the more bitter American political feuds in recent years.
It might not have felt different to them, but I think the last ten years or so have been a lot of miscalculations by a lot of politicians, who were not making mistakes according to what they ‘knew’.
There are a bunch of statistical questions where I don’t have answers for myself. a) Whether the amount and kind of aviation incidents are unusual b) how to estimate the true economic growth potential of LLMs, etc. c) how to sort stuff like covid or Satoshi Nakamoto’s scheme d) whether congressional retirement rates are unusual.
We may see.
I dunno.
Retired Enlisted can also be recalled if the comments or position are that extreme. Granted, that has less of a foundation as compared to occifer types when situations like this happen. And Article 134 is the catchall. He should have kept his mouth shut. But he’s more of a political wonk than an Officer.